Post by Fuck Mike Brown on Dec 21, 2007 21:31:08 GMT -5
Here is the story from John Fay's blog:
The Reds have traded Josh Hamilton to the Texas Rangers for a pair of young pitchers. The top one is Edinson Volquez, the Rangers' minor league pitcher of the year.
Volquez is a 24-year-old right-hander. He was 14-6 with a 3.67 ERA in the two minor league stops last year. He struck out 166 and allowed 98 hits in 144 2/3 innings.
He was 2-1 with 4.50 ERA in six starts for the Rangers.
The other other in the deal is Danny Herrera, a 23-year-old left-handed reliever. He was 7-2 with a 3.69 ERA last year with Bakersfield and Frisco. He struck out 75 and allowed 57 hits in the 63 1/3 innings.
A little instant analysis here: I don't think this means the Reds won't trade for Erik Bedard. It makes it easier to give up Homer Bailey. I think Ryan Freel is the leader in clubhouse in the center field race. But Jay Bruce could be end up there by Opening Day. I think Hamilton will hit a lot of home runs in Texas. Questions about his durability made him easier to trade. Johnny Narron being his personal coach didn't sit well in the clubhouse.
From the conference call:
Hamilton: "It did (surprise me). It really did. I got a call last night. They asked me to come to Texas for a physical."
On Cincinnati: "I was in right place for coming back. A city that had never seen me play welcoming me the way they did on Opening Day. I enjoyed the fans. I enjoyed the organization. I told Wayne to tell Mr. Castellini thank you."
Krivsky: "I look at it as value for value. I made up my mind if we were going to give up Josh, we had to get quality in return. Volquez is a guy who can bolster our rotation for years to come."
On Volquez's stuff: "He's a fastball, curve, change-up pitcher. He's athletic with a live arm. He's from the Dominican. His hero is Pedro Martinez. (Volquez) is a charismatic guy. He's animated on the mound. He pitches from 92 to 94. But he can go get 97 or so. His breaking ball pitch is hard, more like a 'slurve.' His change-up is well above average. He's got impressive stuff. It's a matter of putting it together."
On center field: "That's open for competition. Spring training will determine a lot. (Norris) Hopper, (Ryan) Freel, (Chris) Dickerson and (Jay) Bruce will compete."
Are the Reds still looking for veteran starter? "It depends on what we'd have to give up (in trade) With free agents, it's a matter of dollars and years. We're always looking for pitching. But, with Volquez, (Johnny) Cueto, Matt Maloney and Homer Bailey, we have four pitchers, 21 to 24 (years old), on the cusp of the big leagues. With the ceilings they have, we feel good about the future."
frontier.cincinnati.com/blogs/redsinsider/2007/12/reds-trade-hamilton.asp#comments
And scouting reports on Volquez:
Edinson Volquez has had more highs and lows than your usual top prospect. The Rangers' top prospect in 2005, he fell apart in 2006, going 1-6, 7.29 in eight starts with the Rangers while showing no feel for pitching and poor command. The Rangers decided to start over in 2007, sending him all the way back to high Class A Bakersfield. At the time, it looked like a disastrous decision: Volquez went 0-4, 7.13 in seven starts with the Blaze, but he learned from the experience, found his command and was dominant during a late-season stint with Triple-A Oklahoma (6-1, 1.41). Volquez' newfound success came after he discovered a feel for his curveball. It's still only an average pitch, but that is enough to keep hitters off of his 92-94 mph fastball and his plus changeup. The Rangers have lauded his makeup at times in the past, but they canceled his callup to Texas last August because he overslept and missed a bullpen session. If he keeps his head on straight he has the stuff to be a solid middle-of-the-rotation starter.
and Herrere:
Danny Ray Herrera is the little lefty that could. Despite an 80-82 mph fastball that is slower than many pitchers' changeups, he's survived and actually thrived at times because his changeup is so good. It has a screwball action as it arrives at a bugs-bunny slow-ball-esque 55 to 60 mph. The changeup and a sharp, late-breaking slider have been enough to allow Herrera to get in hitters' heads. There are clearly questions whether his well-below-average velocity will play in Triple-A or the big leagues. At best he's a middle reliever and many will be surprised if he even has that much success, but Herrera has been surprising people ever since he was an All-American at New Mexico.
www.baseballamerica.com/today/majors/news/264581.html
So the Reds finally made a trade today, sending Josh Hamilton to the Rangers for highly rated pitching prospect Edison Volquez and left handed relief prospect Danny Herrera. Now I know that Josh Hamilton was very highly rated among players with fan support in Cincinnati. Here are some of the factors to look at in this deal:
1- We get two good prospects. Volquez has great stuff, but like Homer Bailey, needs to learn how to control it. He did a much better job of it last season in the minors, and looks like he could be ready for a spot in the Reds rotation in this upcoming season. Herrera is a very small guy(5-foot-7, 145 pounds!) and his fastball reflects that, topping out at about 86 MPH. But he has an excellent changeup, with supposedly makes up for the bad velocity of his fastball. I really need to see both pitch before I can finish judgment, but for now, I like them.
2. This trade opens up the door for amazing OF prospect Jay Bruce to start next year in centerfield. With the glut of outfielders before Hamilton was traded, there was no possibility of Bruce starting. But now, he has a good opportunity to win the job in spring training. To do this, he will have to beat out Norris Hopper and Ryan Freel. Because both of the latter mentioned players are meant for the bench in my opinion, I think Bruce should be able to win the job. But, if Freel wins the job, then this reason is bad.
3. This reason could be very good, or very bad. This trade does not mean that the Reds are out of the race for Erik Bedard or Joe Blanton. They might even be better suited to get one of the two pitchers. The Reds now have sort of a big three of starting pitching prospects(Homer Bailey, Johnny Cueto, and Volquez. That means that at least one of them is expendable. If one of them is traded, then the Reds still have two top prospects in pitching.If the Reds even feel desperate enough to trade two of them, then at least one of them is left.
4. Was it right to trade Josh Hamilton for just two pitching prospects? Hamilton was injury prone, and probably still is. It is unknown if Hamilton can make it through an entire season. But when he is healthy, he is phenomenal. If he could play a whole season, then he might be one of the top young and rising players in the league. But, obviously Krivsky thought that Hamilton could be traded. The Reds needed to make room in the outfield, and they got another pitching prospect for the rotation. Krivsky explored other options for Hamilton such as Dontrelle Willis, but no one would trade a proven starter for him.
5. The last thing to consider is the future. Right now, I'm more and more interested in just going young for next season and hoping that a couple of the young players breakout, but focus more on the 2009 season. As a fan, it's very difficult to say this, considering how long young anticipate a new season. But it may be the best option to take. I would still not be against the Reds trading for Bedard, but how much would Baltimore want? If it's Bailey, Votto, and another one of the "big three", then I wouldn't do it. I think that Blanton is the better option now. He might only cost Johnny Cueto, Drew Stubbs, and maybe another prospect. He would be a good number three and a possible number two pitcher. But getting back to the future, the Reds now have a rotation set for 2009 is all goes well in the development of the three pitchers, which might not happen. But if it does, then the Reds have one solid rotation for the future in 2009 and beyond:
1. Aaron Harang
2: Bronson Arroyo
3. Homer Bailey
4. Johnny Cueto
5. Edinson Volquez
So considering all of these factors, I've come to the conclusion that I like this deal. It brings another good pitching prospect into Cincinnati's organization, bodes well for the future, sets Bruce up to play next year, and might even set up a trade for Erik Bedard or Joe Blanton. Krivsky will have to decide if he wants to go for it and be aggressive with Bedard or Blanoton, or just wants to ride it out with the current roster. I'm not sure what he'll do, but I would check the computer every day to see is the Kriv Dog has done something.
You may have noticed that I still labeled the title the "Search For Starting Pitching", which I've pledged to do until the Reds get a decent starting pitcher. This deal doesn't quite cut my expectations. I like it, but I need someone way more proven to take the label of my title.
cincinnatiredsbaseball.blogspot.com/2007/12/reds-trade-hamilton-to-rangerssfsp-day.html
The Reds have traded Josh Hamilton to the Texas Rangers for a pair of young pitchers. The top one is Edinson Volquez, the Rangers' minor league pitcher of the year.
Volquez is a 24-year-old right-hander. He was 14-6 with a 3.67 ERA in the two minor league stops last year. He struck out 166 and allowed 98 hits in 144 2/3 innings.
He was 2-1 with 4.50 ERA in six starts for the Rangers.
The other other in the deal is Danny Herrera, a 23-year-old left-handed reliever. He was 7-2 with a 3.69 ERA last year with Bakersfield and Frisco. He struck out 75 and allowed 57 hits in the 63 1/3 innings.
A little instant analysis here: I don't think this means the Reds won't trade for Erik Bedard. It makes it easier to give up Homer Bailey. I think Ryan Freel is the leader in clubhouse in the center field race. But Jay Bruce could be end up there by Opening Day. I think Hamilton will hit a lot of home runs in Texas. Questions about his durability made him easier to trade. Johnny Narron being his personal coach didn't sit well in the clubhouse.
From the conference call:
Hamilton: "It did (surprise me). It really did. I got a call last night. They asked me to come to Texas for a physical."
On Cincinnati: "I was in right place for coming back. A city that had never seen me play welcoming me the way they did on Opening Day. I enjoyed the fans. I enjoyed the organization. I told Wayne to tell Mr. Castellini thank you."
Krivsky: "I look at it as value for value. I made up my mind if we were going to give up Josh, we had to get quality in return. Volquez is a guy who can bolster our rotation for years to come."
On Volquez's stuff: "He's a fastball, curve, change-up pitcher. He's athletic with a live arm. He's from the Dominican. His hero is Pedro Martinez. (Volquez) is a charismatic guy. He's animated on the mound. He pitches from 92 to 94. But he can go get 97 or so. His breaking ball pitch is hard, more like a 'slurve.' His change-up is well above average. He's got impressive stuff. It's a matter of putting it together."
On center field: "That's open for competition. Spring training will determine a lot. (Norris) Hopper, (Ryan) Freel, (Chris) Dickerson and (Jay) Bruce will compete."
Are the Reds still looking for veteran starter? "It depends on what we'd have to give up (in trade) With free agents, it's a matter of dollars and years. We're always looking for pitching. But, with Volquez, (Johnny) Cueto, Matt Maloney and Homer Bailey, we have four pitchers, 21 to 24 (years old), on the cusp of the big leagues. With the ceilings they have, we feel good about the future."
frontier.cincinnati.com/blogs/redsinsider/2007/12/reds-trade-hamilton.asp#comments
And scouting reports on Volquez:
Edinson Volquez has had more highs and lows than your usual top prospect. The Rangers' top prospect in 2005, he fell apart in 2006, going 1-6, 7.29 in eight starts with the Rangers while showing no feel for pitching and poor command. The Rangers decided to start over in 2007, sending him all the way back to high Class A Bakersfield. At the time, it looked like a disastrous decision: Volquez went 0-4, 7.13 in seven starts with the Blaze, but he learned from the experience, found his command and was dominant during a late-season stint with Triple-A Oklahoma (6-1, 1.41). Volquez' newfound success came after he discovered a feel for his curveball. It's still only an average pitch, but that is enough to keep hitters off of his 92-94 mph fastball and his plus changeup. The Rangers have lauded his makeup at times in the past, but they canceled his callup to Texas last August because he overslept and missed a bullpen session. If he keeps his head on straight he has the stuff to be a solid middle-of-the-rotation starter.
and Herrere:
Danny Ray Herrera is the little lefty that could. Despite an 80-82 mph fastball that is slower than many pitchers' changeups, he's survived and actually thrived at times because his changeup is so good. It has a screwball action as it arrives at a bugs-bunny slow-ball-esque 55 to 60 mph. The changeup and a sharp, late-breaking slider have been enough to allow Herrera to get in hitters' heads. There are clearly questions whether his well-below-average velocity will play in Triple-A or the big leagues. At best he's a middle reliever and many will be surprised if he even has that much success, but Herrera has been surprising people ever since he was an All-American at New Mexico.
www.baseballamerica.com/today/majors/news/264581.html
So the Reds finally made a trade today, sending Josh Hamilton to the Rangers for highly rated pitching prospect Edison Volquez and left handed relief prospect Danny Herrera. Now I know that Josh Hamilton was very highly rated among players with fan support in Cincinnati. Here are some of the factors to look at in this deal:
1- We get two good prospects. Volquez has great stuff, but like Homer Bailey, needs to learn how to control it. He did a much better job of it last season in the minors, and looks like he could be ready for a spot in the Reds rotation in this upcoming season. Herrera is a very small guy(5-foot-7, 145 pounds!) and his fastball reflects that, topping out at about 86 MPH. But he has an excellent changeup, with supposedly makes up for the bad velocity of his fastball. I really need to see both pitch before I can finish judgment, but for now, I like them.
2. This trade opens up the door for amazing OF prospect Jay Bruce to start next year in centerfield. With the glut of outfielders before Hamilton was traded, there was no possibility of Bruce starting. But now, he has a good opportunity to win the job in spring training. To do this, he will have to beat out Norris Hopper and Ryan Freel. Because both of the latter mentioned players are meant for the bench in my opinion, I think Bruce should be able to win the job. But, if Freel wins the job, then this reason is bad.
3. This reason could be very good, or very bad. This trade does not mean that the Reds are out of the race for Erik Bedard or Joe Blanton. They might even be better suited to get one of the two pitchers. The Reds now have sort of a big three of starting pitching prospects(Homer Bailey, Johnny Cueto, and Volquez. That means that at least one of them is expendable. If one of them is traded, then the Reds still have two top prospects in pitching.If the Reds even feel desperate enough to trade two of them, then at least one of them is left.
4. Was it right to trade Josh Hamilton for just two pitching prospects? Hamilton was injury prone, and probably still is. It is unknown if Hamilton can make it through an entire season. But when he is healthy, he is phenomenal. If he could play a whole season, then he might be one of the top young and rising players in the league. But, obviously Krivsky thought that Hamilton could be traded. The Reds needed to make room in the outfield, and they got another pitching prospect for the rotation. Krivsky explored other options for Hamilton such as Dontrelle Willis, but no one would trade a proven starter for him.
5. The last thing to consider is the future. Right now, I'm more and more interested in just going young for next season and hoping that a couple of the young players breakout, but focus more on the 2009 season. As a fan, it's very difficult to say this, considering how long young anticipate a new season. But it may be the best option to take. I would still not be against the Reds trading for Bedard, but how much would Baltimore want? If it's Bailey, Votto, and another one of the "big three", then I wouldn't do it. I think that Blanton is the better option now. He might only cost Johnny Cueto, Drew Stubbs, and maybe another prospect. He would be a good number three and a possible number two pitcher. But getting back to the future, the Reds now have a rotation set for 2009 is all goes well in the development of the three pitchers, which might not happen. But if it does, then the Reds have one solid rotation for the future in 2009 and beyond:
1. Aaron Harang
2: Bronson Arroyo
3. Homer Bailey
4. Johnny Cueto
5. Edinson Volquez
So considering all of these factors, I've come to the conclusion that I like this deal. It brings another good pitching prospect into Cincinnati's organization, bodes well for the future, sets Bruce up to play next year, and might even set up a trade for Erik Bedard or Joe Blanton. Krivsky will have to decide if he wants to go for it and be aggressive with Bedard or Blanoton, or just wants to ride it out with the current roster. I'm not sure what he'll do, but I would check the computer every day to see is the Kriv Dog has done something.
You may have noticed that I still labeled the title the "Search For Starting Pitching", which I've pledged to do until the Reds get a decent starting pitcher. This deal doesn't quite cut my expectations. I like it, but I need someone way more proven to take the label of my title.
cincinnatiredsbaseball.blogspot.com/2007/12/reds-trade-hamilton-to-rangerssfsp-day.html
